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Why are female Moliwe so fragile?

chriscoli

Administrator
Hmmmm...interesting comments. I like the harem idea. If kribs are any indication, though, multiple males aren't well tolerated by each other...but I had them in a small (10 gal) tank. Might work if I put them in something with a bit more floorspace. Right now, I've been keeping a pair in a heavily planted 20 long with some ancistrus and a bunch of white clouds.

At least I know I'm not alone, now! I'll give Anton a holler.
 

Avatar

Plenipotentiary-at-large
Go figure

At least I know I'm not alone, now!

Never understood the misery loves company thing, always felt tribulations to be cheapened by others suffering the same complaint.

Didn't see/hear anything in the video about harvesting sperm, just eggs. Am curious how they manage it.
 
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JasonC

Members
Didn't see/hear anything in the video about harvesting sperm, just eggs. Am curious how they manage it.

I stand corrected. Been a while since I stumbled on that video. They don't go into details on collecting the milt. I am also curious about how it is done. tried some quick google searches (that'll be interesting to explain to the wife) and the info I found involved eviscerating both the males and females... but this was mostly on salmon who die after they spawn anyways. One site mentioned the use of a piece of PVC to "gently escort the fish on to the next plane".. yeah... not so much...

If you can get past the high schoolers in the video, it is actually a bit interesting. Some interesting tidbits about the fertilization process that I didn't know. And they did mention briefly that some of the females that the kids were going to be harvesting would have "bad eggs", and even some may have just the shells left after the unused eggs were reabsorbed. So it seems that this can be used to remedy egg bound fish... but I have my doubts that it can be done gently enough to not squish any fish smaller than a breeding age game fish...

Hey... one of you engineers in the club... invent a tool to make this possible! :rolleyes:
 

Avatar

Plenipotentiary-at-large
Get away from me with that PVC!

I believe with a very light touch one might manage the egg part, even if one needed some gentle method/narcotic agent to temporarily stun the females, but the sperm? I think "evisceration" (good word - thank goodness sportscasters haven't discovered it yet) the likely means here, hence my original irreverent query.

So is there a safe reliable over the counter "anaesthetic" or method for doping fish? I bet the Endler King knows...
 

JasonC

Members
Its a shame if killing the fish is the only way to get the milt out of the males...

In regards to anesthetic, I have heard low doses of clove oil... apparently what most people think of as a way to euthanize is really just a lethal dose of anesthetic.

There are some interesting videos on the 'tube of people doing surgery on their fish after using dilute clove oil to put them under... Including a pretty remarkable one with an owner cutting off a damaged tail on a very expensive arowana to allow it to grow back without deformity.
 

msjinkzd

invert junkie
My moliwes did really well in a large group, Iw ouldn't really call it a harem as it was pretty close to an even split between males and females. They were in a 29g, I believe I had 3m/5f to start, as juveniles.

At any given time, I had random dithers in there, from otos to hatchets, but what seemed to help the most was a lot of areas for them to hide from each other. I had coconut huts, little ceramic caves, leaf litter, driftwood, and lots of java fern as well as floating plants. I would often see females behaving as you mentioned, but they would disappear in a cave for a few days, seemingly to recover, then would be out and about again.

I believe that i only lost one, even of the fry I reared that then started breeding again. I always kept them in a group, again, an almost near even split of gender. There would quickly be a dominant pair, and the rest just sort of took it upon themselves to avoid the dominant two. There was never much damage, just some chasing and body shaking to show dominance by the males.

It was suggested to me the other day, by whom I cannot remember (I think I was talkign to Stepan Tanner), that the pyrrhulina are a fantastic dither not just for SA dwarf cichlids, but also the pelvicachromis, as they are big enough to stand their ground and not at all shy. I may try some in my current krib tank (75g, also has Hypoptopoma gulare, which the kribs love to chase away).
 

chriscoli

Administrator
Good to know. I'm definitely going to be looking at doing a larger group in a bigger tank. The one I have them in is heavily planted....heavy enough that I'm actually having baby white clouds survive!

I'm growing out my batch of moliwe juvies right now, but I can tell that this group is female-heavy. I wasn't watching my pH when they spawned...and I know that with these fish, that determines the M/F ratio.

Anyhow, I may need to find an extra male or two if I don't get any with these grow-outs.
 

chriscoli

Administrator
Yeah, I know...and remember, your punk got..."punked" by my punks, too. I think my fish are angry at your fish.
 

Andrewtfw

Global Moderators
In keeping with tradition, I am in the process of losing my female pelvicachromis subocellatus the same as all the other female pelvies I have lost. She is sitting on the bottom, heavily breathing and mouth is protruding. Has been swimming and eating (spectrum flake, yfs algae pellets) up until today.
 
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