Tribute to Lake Malawi on Ad Konings Week.

[Larry Johnson]

What keeps the Peacocks from Hybridizing in the wild? Or are the species we see now hybrids?

This Lake is not some backyard pond,this Lake is the 9th Largest and 7th deepest lake in the world.
The Aulonocara's do not travel around the lake looking for other Aulonocara's to spawn with,each species is usually a geographic variant or individual species that have been kept seperated by natural barriers such as deep water,rivers or extended sandy beach area's.
There are, in some area's, more than one type of Aulonocara found at a given location.These fish sometimes inhabit different levels in the water,some deep,some shallow.
While there are a few spots that do have both living right beside each other,they never seem to cross.There are no "alpha" males hovering over an area wanting to spawn with anything that goes by,,,there are enough of their own species to spawn with.
Males act quite differently in your aquarium,,,although they chase con-specific males away from where they want to spawn they don't chase for long,,,they spend most of their time eating/scratching out an existance and won't expend tons of energy on chasing other males,,,the chasing is left for females.
Sparring has been observed by anyone who has been diving in the Lake I'm sure,,,but not to much comes of it.
I have NEVER observed a "cross bred" Aulonocara in the wild as yet,,,in a couple locations as many as 5 species have been found.(Eg. Luwala Reef)

Cheers,Larry

 

[Sonny Disposition]

During Ad's presentation yesterday, I was struck by the tendency of this group of fishes to stay put. Not all fishes have that tendency. The fishes of the Everglades are really mobile, for example. But since the Everglades is a nutrient poor, harsh environment, subject to cold spells and seasonal drying and flooding, I guess fish the fish either had to move around or risk disappearing.

Because the Malawi cichlids don't move much, I'm guessing that the Lake is a much more constant environment, by comparison. Larry, would you say that's true?

 

[Larry Johnson]

Yes,Ads always puts on a great talk.
I would certainly aggree that these fish do not move around,as in migrate to other area's,some people just don't get it though!
Did Ad mention anything about natural barriers and how they apply to keeping the fish localized?
I know at the end of every speaking engagment the speaker always calls on the crowd for a couple questions,,,,I hope you all had some for him,,,to me asking questions at the end means that the talk went over well and the crowd wanted more!

Cheers,Larry

 

[longstocking]

I agree with Larry... it's hard to explain though unless you are a diver.

Most fish... except for predators and open water species don't move around a lot.


For instance, if I was to go diving on a wreck off ocean city more than once... I would probably see a lot of the same fish I saw the first time. They don't move all that much. Of course the bigger the fish the more they move around typically... but fish don't roam around the wild endlessly.

 

[Sonny Disposition]

No, they don't move around endlessly, but they do move in response to changes in the environment.

For example, N.A. stream fish tend to migrate downstream when the weather gets colder. Likewise, big centrarchids may move into the shallows to spawn, but seek out deeper waters in the summer and winter.

The larger blackbanded sunfish are thought to move to deeper waters when the weather turns really hot.

I know that gar in the Everglades move around quite a bit.

I don't know of anything North American equivalent that would stay put around a rock pile long enough to give rise to the same degree of variation and speciation that we saw yesterday with the Aulonocara of Lake Malawi.

 

[Larry Johnson]

OK guys,lets think bigger!
For a moment lets apply this same thinking to a saltwater fish,then we have the worlds oceans to take into consideration.
Think of a species that we probably all know of,,,,Opercula Clownfish (ya Nemo),,,,why are they only found in the Pacific Ocean,specifically around the Philipines (and some other Islands in that part of the world) ?
Why don't you find them in Florida swimming around (and I'm NOT talking about captive releases either)
Would you say that 1000's of miles of deep and open water would prevent them from travelling? Maybe it might be that North and South America might be in the way.
In Lake Malawi the same idea happens to seperate genus color varieties,each developing their own coloration pattern over hundreds of years, due to seperation.(on a much smaller basis)
At Lions Cove a mere 100-150 meters of beach sand barricades two color varieties of Labidochromis caerulues from mixing!
Each group clinging to the rocks on either side of the cove.The centre of the cove being to deep as well for this group to mix.
These are natural barriers that keep mbuna, rock dwellers, who are 'tied' to the rocks from mixing together to make only one color variety.
As far as migration goes,yes there are some Copadichromis types (and others) that migrate at certain times of the year to spawn in shallower water, but are still localized, and still tied to the rocks.
These fish seem to come back to where mom and dad spawned and although they spend there time growing up closer to shore before heading to deeper water, they never really leave the area to travel north/south,or from the East to West.
They still have to have contact with the bottom.
As with Nemo,there is always the possiblity of being deposited in another area, and I have observed this at Thumbi Island West!

Cheers,Larry

 

[F8LBITE]

Yes,Ads always puts on a great talk.
I would certainly aggree that these fish do not move around,as in migrate to other area's,some people just don't get it though!
Did Ad mention anything about natural barriers and how they apply to keeping the fish localized?
I know at the end of every speaking engagment the speaker always calls on the crowd for a couple questions,,,,I hope you all had some for him,,,to me asking questions at the end means that the talk went over well and the crowd wanted more!

Cheers,Larry

Interesting points Larry, thanks for answering my question. Ad mentioned his back was hurting and wrapped it up pretty quick after his presentation. I found it interesting when he spoke about the different fish not being able to be brought up to the surface because of the pressure differences and how theres hundreds more fish species yet to be discovered.

 

[longstocking]

Basically there is no way to bring them up due to the time it takes to get them up ...

but most importantly. Lake malawi doesn't have the correct mixture for divers to go to 300 feet. They only have air to dive on. Now... if malawi was a tourist trap... this could be fixed....

someday.... it's just many many years from now.

 

[marge618]

No, they don't move around endlessly, but they do move in response to changes in the environment.

For example, N.A. stream fish tend to migrate downstream when the weather gets colder. Likewise, big centrarchids may move into the shallows to spawn, but seek out deeper waters in the summer and winter.

The larger blackbanded sunfish are thought to move to deeper waters when the weather turns really hot.

I know that gar in the Everglades move around quite a bit.

I don't know of anything North American equivalent that would stay put around a rock pile long enough to give rise to the same degree of variation and speciation that we saw yesterday with the Aulonocara of Lake Malawi.

Thanks for your input. It helps to think about another factor: movement or lack of it when comparing fish.

Now I wish I understood better how the peacocks can exist seemingly in the same area of Lake Malawi and not crossbreed.

 

[SubMariner]

Thanx Larry for your insight on the matter. Mr. Ad Konings did a fantastic job as usual. He is such a humble man and that was great to see.


Richard

 

[Larry Johnson]

It sounds like you all had a great time there!

I found it interesting when he spoke about the different fish not being able to be brought up to the surface because of the pressure differences and how theres hundreds more fish species yet to be discovered.

Decompessing fish is at a rate of about 25 feet per day! (pers.comm Stuart Grant) ,,,now Stuart was never a diver,but for those that do know 33 feet is one atmosphere of pressure,so Stuart was not far off,,,,but if it were me collecting the fish they could have been brought up 25 feet in the morning and afternoon,,,more work but the fish could be brought in a day or two sooner.
Rhamphochromis are brought up by 'hook and line' fisherman,and exibit extended bellies from coming up to fast,,,they are marked on the Fish Finder at the 100 meter mark!(tastes like Walleye!)
There have been a few come up from those deep locations alive,but not many. The amount of deep fish is eveident by all the Dr.George Turner photo's (dead) in the 4th edition,which were the result of deep net trawling,,,back in the day before that part of the fisheries went defunct,,,good insight on Georges part!

Lake malawi doesn't have the correct mixture for divers to go to 300 feet. They only have air to dive on. Now... if malawi was a tourist trap... this could be fixed....

Not maybe as backward as you think ,but 'Trimix' can be obtained right at Chembe Village at the Dive Shop there!
I am not sure about the Dive Shop at Nkhata Bay though,but 'probably'.
Peraonally I am not a 'trimix' deep diver,although I visit the 100 ft plus mark in area's where it is easy to do so.
Diving to 150 ft in the Lake really is like the dark side of the moon,fish appear only in shades of grey and black,,,sometimes it's hard enough to figure out what you are taking a picture of when everything is in color (less than 40 ft),,,or shades of green (60 ft 80)
I would say the main problem is that you just go through to much air at a depth of 130 ft taking pictures of Taeniolethrinops sp guarding their nest. Got a few cool shots though!
Risky at best,there are no Hyperbalic Chambers to decompress a diver with the 'Bends'(!) ,but I do have a dive computer,and avoid decompession,,,always!

Now I wish I understood better how the peacocks can exist seemingly in the same area of Lake Malawi and not crossbreed.

Yes,I know what you mean!
Remember the spawning males are 'flashy' and if you are totally familiar with the species you are looking at ,,,you CAN see the difference,so the fish certainly can!
Over 35 years of me keeping fish together I have had only one instance of fish cross breeding. Believe it or not,it was a N.polystigma with a D.compressicep!
Give the males space and lots of females,and they will spawn with there own,no need to chase others to spawn.

He is such a humble man and that was great to see.

He sure is! He gives credit where credit is due and I have had several pics and comments from him in his 4th edition,to prove it. I also see other additions to this great book from others who I have dove with in Lake Malawi.
We are in fact good friends.

Did anyone buy his 'Malawi Cichlids Feeding Behaviour' DVD, its a great DVD, some great feeding behaviour,some of which I had even missed!

Cheers,Larry

 

[Larry Johnson]

Hey Submariner,just wanted to point out those video's at the start of this thread,,,the third one down 'Lake Malawi Safaris 2008' was one of my Safaris members from last year Patrik from Sweden,,,he's 19 years old!
FYI

Cheers,Larry

 

[fweed]

How wonderful that is. I would love to take a trip there to see for myself. The blue orchard is so beautiful and the hongi.

 

[DiscusnAfricans]

someday.... it's just many many years from now.

I can only hope... I'd love to dive in the lake. I'll be the first to sign up for a trip if Malawi becomes a tourist attraction and the area isn't involved in a war.

 

[SubMariner]

Hey Submariner,just wanted to point out those video's at the start of this thread,,,the third one down 'Lake Malawi Safaris 2008' was one of my Safaris members from last year Patrik from Sweden,,,he's 19 years old!
FYI

Cheers,Larry

Thanx Larry for the info.

Yes, the Blue Orchid is a gorgeous fish and very rare as well.



Cheers Mate,


Richard

 

[Larry Johnson]

I can only hope... I'd love to dive in the lake. I'll be the first to sign up for a trip if Malawi becomes a tourist attraction and the area isn't involved in a war.

Lake Malawi has been a tourist attraction longer than we've been into Cichlids.
Malawi had it's troubles back in the late 60's early 70's and has been peacefull ever since.
Did you want me to sign you up now:happy0144:

Cheers,Larry

 

[DiscusnAfricans]

Lake Malawi has been a tourist attraction longer than we've been into Cichlids.
Malawi had it's troubles back in the late 60's early 70's and has been peacefull ever since.
Did you want me to sign you up now:happy0144:

Cheers,Larry

Will you take a post-dated check? If so, then sign me up. Otherwise, I'm sure its beyond my budget at the moment. Are regular trips organized often?

 

[Larry Johnson]

Are regular trips organized often?

Yes,they are still being done. Depending on availiability of the boats and compressor.
I am not organizing one this year though, I will be in Malawi for about 9 weeks working on a project.
Its almost the end of an era of so called Malawi Safaris.I have been stating this since before Stuart Grant had died. This will be my 9th year going back to Malawi and I have run 4 Safaris,,,either alone or shared with Ad.(he did the first week and I did the second week)
Stuart and I had spent many a night e-mailing back and forth of what we were going to do with the safaris each year. Times,dates,logistics of the trip,,,even,food,radios,batteries the list is endless.
His British Colonialism was always shinning through,which I admired, even in his itinerary pages he made up for me. He was very good at details,,,he went so far as to check the astrological activity for us,,,since there is no TV at night!,,,while we were out on the boat!
Each year my list of 'things to bring' would get bigger, all this stuff was either for the boats or customers.
While he visited here in Canada, we took him to Canadian Tire,,, amoungst other places,,, they have a large sporting goods dep't where he spent a ton of money and then we all had to take this sh*t to Malawi,, (2001)
We always had a good laugh over many beers and bottles of Scotch going over the plans and having a big laugh at the end of it all, when things were finished up at the end,there was always a big story over dinner (or any time he was around) or a last blow out BBQ at Kambiri Point which a lot of us call/called home.
Now that he has past away (Oct 2007) its only a matter of time now that he's gone that the boats and facilities crumble around his disappearance.
Stuart's charm and charisma is just not there.
I did a small Safaris last year with 4 of us,it went over really well ,but I miss my old buddy,,that part I'll always miss.
Gotta say it was quiet when we returned back to Kambiri Point when we were finishing up the trip, Malawians just don't make the big fuss over things to make the trip a big deal, which to all of us it really IS! The ,,,saving up/travelling far distances/arriving in an unknown country/out on the boat/observing the fish,,is really what its all about etc.,,, is a big deal,,,Stuart was aware!
Though, there are others doing the same thing,its not really the same as going out on the lake in those big Malawian made boats (28-36 footers!) ,that Baolin the boat builer had made (and he is getting old and fragile too)
Its the atmosphere of being around the oldest,biggest and best shipper in Malawi,,,visiting the Fish Export Station (on site) etc. Seeing and hearing all about fish,how it was and how it is now.
As long as I can I will be going back to Malawi,I will run the Safaris,I don't mind this at all,but will it end?
YES,I just can't say when.

Cheers,Larry

 

[SubMariner]

Larry, that was a touching story about Stuart and I'm sure he was a special Man. It would of been a pleasure to have meet him, but his work echos his existence.

I'm sure the stars must have been absolutely gorgeous in that region. Now that's TV in my book.

I also look forward to someday traveling to the Great Lake Malawi to see for myself the beauty of it's presence and it's inhabitants.

Reading your story only gives me hope to someday take the big step to travel to good ole Malawi and explore the Lake. Hopefully in 2010 or 2011.

Trust me, it's on my list ToDo's in my lifetime. Please more stories Larry!


Cheers Mate,


Richard Mendez

 

[Larry Johnson]

Larry, that was a touching story about Stuart and I'm sure he was a special Man. It would of been a pleasure to have meet him, but his work echos his existence.

I think the last time Stuart spoke was at the NEC in Farmington ,CN back in 2001 I believe,,,he always enjoyed talking with hobbyists,,,as he was one himself once,,,I think he never really let that part go.
Originally he had collected killiefish and sent them back to England,,,then later on was asked to export cichlids from the country by the Gov't,,so this is how he started.
Stuart,while entertaining a Canadian hobbyist (apprentise,for about 3 months) again was out collecting Killies Nothobranchius sp.) with him,,,which I thought was interesting (2003).

I'm sure the stars must have been absolutely gorgeous in that region. Now that's TV in my book

Yes,the Stars are gorgious at night over there,,,no city lights to interrupt the veiw.
As with most eveings there's not much to do,especially if there is no power (to do computer work,downloading the days pics etc).

Please more stories Larry!

After dinner,around 7 pm (after sunset) ,at Chiofu Camp on the east side of the lake,we have a coffee and settle down into a few chairs and chat about the day and later on well into the darkness of the night,we watch the sardine fisherman on the other side of the bay get ready to head out for a night of fishing.
Things seem simple at that point,no phones,no TV,no kids or wife,,,maybe a little far off noise from the radio that the other boys are listening to,but Chi Chu Wa is spoken over the radio with some English here and there mixed in,,,and although I can't speak the language I can pick out partially what is going on,but mostly ignore it.
The stars are awesome,and I usually am the last one heading to bed.
8:30 ia usually bed time as sunrise is around 4:30 am and our alarm clock is the generator filling our scuba tanks,,,,no snooze button to hit after all that noise begins!
First dive may be as early as 7 am but nobody is in a rush,,,with only two or 3 dives planned for the day. A little snooze time on the boat is usually what goes on between the dives, depending on how far we have to travel between them.There are cushions on the boat below the roof or we take them up top on the roof to sun ourselves to warm up after diving.
Planning the day as far as downloading pics go,we hook up to a Power Inverter to get 110v electricity,,,so there's a bit of a flurry to get batteries charging and pics downloaded,,,,computers charged up.
If every thing is charged and ready to go,,,we do a pics preview after dinner with coffee,,,,by that time I have already deleted any bad pics and there is always lots of ooooo's and awwww's!
Makes for some great chat time,,,since there is absolutley nothing else to do,,,but I go for the fish,so this is what its all about.
Once you travel with a group, you are all friends for life!
Most notable people that you all may know are Ad & Gertrud (of coarse) Chuck & Carol Rambo, Pam Chin, Steve Lundblad, Mehmet Kurgan ,Martin Geerts, Walter DeProst (Blegian Cichlid Assoc President) ,Lars Anderson,Steve Somermeyer, David & Sonia Gianine and a whole host of others from Canada,Germany, Japan,Norway and Sweden.
Some of these people have there work credited in Ad's new 4th edition.

Anything else?

Cheers,Larry