American Cichlid Association

MAJORLY BUMMED!!!!

Jefft

Jefft

Members
:angry3: So this evening I did my water changes, carefully measured out my SAFE, Salt, Tea Tree Oil Drops, and buffer I drained all my tanks and then began the process of cleaning out my filters. I refilled my tanks with 75ish degree water and added in my mix which I might add I have had wonderful success with. Everything was great. So I got ready to turn in for the night. I turned on the blue night lights in the tanks and headed off to sleepy land. I don't know why but I happened to roll over in bed ( 3 of my tanks are in my bedroom) and glance towards my 30g cube which houses all the 1 to 1 1/2 inch fry, consisting of Red Empress, Rusties and Yellow Labs. Well, long story longer nightmares escaped sleep world and invaded my fry tank, tons of my fry are on the bottom on their sides or belly up. I grabbed my python and began an immediate drain of the tank, grabbed a net and caught everything including the on their sides and belly up fish. Those who looked dead went into a bowl the rest who were fighting and looking alright immediately went into my 40g breeder. I wasn't to concerned on figuring out the issue at that particular moment as I was far more preoccupied with the evacuation of all fry to the 40. I drained the water and once everyone was sorted either in the dead bowl or into the 40 (again anything showing any semblance of life went into the 40) Once they were sorted I went looking for the issue. I found it needless to say on the back wall of the tank, there was a glass heater purchased through Petsmart ruptured and busted.

Death count so far I am sure more to come but so hoping not. - 10 Red Empress
5 Yellow Labs

Many others are settled on the bottom of the tank still seemingly struggling. Strange, but all rusties seem to be ok. Plecos are fine as well.

Questions for you guys.

I am guessing it was electric shock?
Do these glass heaters with "wire" filaments inside have any form of chemical that would have contaminated my water thus poisoning my fish?
How many more should I expect to lose?
Anyone had this happen to them?
How optimistic should I be about recovery chances of those who are still visibly struggling?
Have I endangered my 40G population by putting the refugees in there? :mad::angry3:
 
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Avatar

Avatar

Plenipotentiary-at-large
Why heaters are the one thing no one should ever low-ball.

No chemicals or need for such in heaters that I'm aware, unlikely that it/they would be instantaneously water soluble and toxic if there were, suspect they simply got electrocuted/stunned and that what you're seeing is a function of varying tolerance among individuals/species and/or relative distance from the heater at time of "failure". Should be zero communicable risk from co-mingling in other tanks unless its of an unrelated behavioral variety.

I'd say you're lucky to have any survivors at all - would have thought that a ruptured heater would spell curtains for everyone. Have fun with PetSmart - really - you're driving, always works better when you smile IME. At very least you should get a top of the line replacement heater and maybe a gift certificate or one time store deep discount (read as their cost for whatever you have designs upon).

Take heart - could have been a total wipe.
 
Jefft

Jefft

Members
Now that is something I hadn't even thought of. But yeah they did kill through faulty merchandise a healthy auction lot in profit for me.
 
jonclark96

jonclark96

Past CCA President
Sorry about the losses. Avatar is spot on with his responses to your questions.

What kind of heater was it? Did you unplug it during the water change?
 
Jefft

Jefft

Members
It was a Petco Elite heater I purchased for a 10 g set up. It was cheap and I thought to use it only once in a while for a hospital tank or the like. I am in a 4th floor apartment so the heat from folks under us over toasts our place so I keep my window open through the winter, hence my room gets very cold at night and I put it in the 30g with another heater to keep the fry nice and warm.. Didnt mean to fry the fry.. loss count has gone up dramatically. The first casualties I flushed. The rest I am bagging and taking with me to Petco to speak to a manager and show him the damages done. I am so pissed these fry were going in our next auction and they were stunning. Sighs. Time to go gather the fallen.

Sam. What is demand or expect for this sort of situation? Certainly a refund of the cost of the heater does not cover my losses. The Red Empress were the most valuable of the fatalities and the most numerous. I mean what can I reasonably expect? I figure Red Empress, one should expect 8.00 per fish, 10 were lost in the first wave alone.
 
Jefft

Jefft

Members
Only a couple still look like they are in distress. Everyone else seems to be functioning well. Here are the tallies.

Dead Count-

Red Empress- 17
Yellow Labs- 43 Yellow lab far out number the Red Empress losses.
Rusty- 3

Total Dead- 63 all at 1 inch or better.

My thought was to take the bag of dead fish with me to Petco with the ruptured heater and ask for refund of monies for the heater and reimbursement for the fish. I figured 8.00 per fish on the Red Empress and 5.00 per for the Rusties and Yellow Labs. For a total loss excluding the cheap heater 366.00 which I will gladly take in trade. Is this fair ya'll?
 
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Jefft

Jefft

Members
jonclark96 said:
Sorry about the losses. Avatar is spot on with his responses to your questions.

What kind of heater was it? Did you unplug it during the water change?
Click to expand...

Jon. Yeah man all my tank stuff for each tank is plugged into a power strip so when I begin water changes I turn off the power strip and only turn the power strip back on when the heaters are fully covered with the fresh water.
 
Avatar

Avatar

Plenipotentiary-at-large
"Tis the season

Jefft said:
It was a Petco Elite heater I purchased for a 10 g set up. What is demand or expect for this sort of situation? Certainly a refund of the cost of the heater does not cover my losses. The Red Empress were the most valuable of the fatalities and the most numerous. I mean what can I reasonably expect? I figure Red Empress, one should expect 8.00 per fish, 10 were lost in the first wave alone.
Click to expand...

You should demand nothing expect to remain unfulfilled (in this instance). You have the heater and the bodies as evidence but most retailers assume limited liability for merchandise, even so-called "elite" merchandise. Much will depend on with whom you speak, but I'd expect even a store manager to be limited in their capacity/inclination to make you entirely "whole". I would walk in, stay absolutely calm and simply ask to speak with whomever is in charge at the time about what can be done. Expect to walk out with a free replacement heater (or not) and a yearning/need to write a letter directly to Petco management/customer relations. Either keep the heater or take pictures before you surrender it, same with the fallen. PR is important at the chain level, less so locally, corporate is your best chance for satisfaction.

Be Zen, remember that the folks at Petco are just folks and just work there, there are no villains in this story (yet), and it's not worth losing your face over this. If and when the conversation starts to head south, smile and ask for the person with whom you're speaking to write down their name and the national HQ/PR address - the implied threat is far more potent than anything else and will afford you the best chance for on-site satisfaction, just don't expect they're going to buy your fish, though corporate may respond in a way that approaches what you deem just (think gift certificate), particularly once they learn that you work as an IT for social networking sites. :D
 
Prince

Prince

The ONE who is The ONE
Did you buy the heater in store or on line? Petco online is run as a separate entity and the will tell you to contact their customer service. If you brought it in store the most you will get is a refund or replacement of the heater. The payment for the fish loss will have to be approved by a DM or higher. Don't be surprised if the make you prove the worth of the fish.


On a side note I don't think Petco sells a heater under the elite moniker that's a Hagen line. Judging by the design of the Petco brand heaters the are made by Aqueon. Does the top of the heater have a ball design or does it look like a widening cone?
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dogofwar

dogofwar

CCA Members
Anyone know who makes Petco's brand of heaters?

Matt

Avatar said:
You should demand nothing expect to remain unfulfilled (in this instance). You have the heater and the bodies as evidence but most retailers assume limited liability for merchandise, even so-called "elite" merchandise. Much will depend on with whom you speak, but I'd expect even a store manager to be limited in their capacity/inclination to make you entirely "whole". I would walk in, stay absolutely calm and simply ask to speak with whomever is in charge at the time about what can be done. Expect to walk out with a free replacement heater (or not) and a yearning/need to write a letter directly to Petco management/customer relations. Either keep the heater or take pictures before you surrender it, same with the fallen. PR is important at the chain level, less so locally, corporate is your best chance for satisfaction.

Be Zen, remember that the folks at Petco are just folks and just work there, there are no villains in this story (yet), and it's not worth losing your face over this. If and when the conversation starts to head south, smile and ask for the person with whom you're speaking to write down their name and the national HQ/PR address - the implied threat is far more potent than anything else and will afford you the best chance for on-site satisfaction, just don't expect they're going to buy your fish, though corporate may respond in a way that approaches what you deem just (think gift certificate), particularly once they learn that you work as an IT for social networking sites. :D
Click to expand...
 
jonclark96

jonclark96

Past CCA President
I think they'll offer a replacement heater, but won't do anything about the fish. Stay calm and see what you can do.
 
dogofwar

dogofwar

CCA Members
I think that the chances of you getting the $366 are pretty small. But they'll likely give you a replacement heater.

Matt

Jefft said:
Only a couple still look like they are in distress. Everyone else seems to be functioning well. Here are the tallies.

Dead Count-

Red Empress- 17
Yellow Labs- 43 Yellow lab far out number the Red Empress losses.
Rusty- 3

Total Dead- 63 all at 1 inch or better.

My thought was to take the bag of dead fish with me to Petco with the ruptured heater and ask for refund of monies for the heater and reimbursement for the fish. I figured 8.00 per fish on the Red Empress and 5.00 per for the Rusties and Yellow Labs. For a total loss excluding the cheap heater 366.00 which I will gladly take in trade. Is this fair ya'll?
Click to expand...
 
Avatar

Avatar

Plenipotentiary-at-large
JMO

I think you have a rather exalted notion about the value of juvenile haps. These are not at all uncommon species, they're young, and at club auctions you could very well end up getting a mere $1/fish or having to take them back home with you. PetCo may be induced/inclined to placate you, but they're never going to incentivize calamities by compensating clients to the extent you propose. JMO.
 
S

samsmobb

Members
They will gladly offer you a replacement heater or gift card for the heaters value. They will not however, give you any money towards fish not purchased through them. Just like buying a sick fish and it killing all the fish in your tank, they will give you a refund for said dead fish but nothing towards your losses.
 
Jefft

Jefft

Members
Prince was right it was a Hagen Elite Heather. I was not offered a replacement heater. I was told to get in touch with Hagen corporate offices. Ohh well. we all have those fishy days when things dont go right. There will be plenty more fry soon enough seeing how these guys reproduce. Thanks again for tall the advice yall.
 
S

samsmobb

Members
Which Petco are yu going to lol
If you bought the heater recently just go in to the cashier n say you wan an exchange
 
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