If You Use the CCA Forum Marketplace...

I also agree with Pat...and that's why our forum and marketplace are open to both guests and members.

CCA serves a unique role among cichlid clubs in the US. We're both one of the largest and most active not-for-profit cichlid clubs (with monthly meetings and paid membership focused in the DC area) and one of the largest and most active cichlid forums.

That means that we have lots of visitors to the forum from all over and from the local area. Both are a good thing.

I'm unapologetic, though, about asking folks who use the forum and/or come to meetings, especially to make money, to contribute to the club by joining and/or volunteering.

Is it required? Nope. Does it help out? You betcha.

Matt

Pat Kelly said:

This is the same with members finding fish they are looking for. There are times that a non member is selling something that a club member is interested in.

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I've kept a type of fish for years that I don't see on your 'List of species bred in the club'. Actually, you have one case where the species is mentioned, but the species name is wrong for the fish-- since the thread appears to be a members only thread, I haven't said anything about that. And since the thread appears to be a members only thread I haven't posted this or other species I've bred or might have available.

Occasionally I'll sell some, but the one species, especially, is an in demand fish that, believe me, I'd hardly need the Marketplace here to sell them. I used to be heavier into breeding, but I cut way back a few years ago and breed only on a small scale right now and only occasionally sell or trade fish. I'm also quite selective about the species I breed. So, I'm hardly profiting from the hobby in any shape or form.

So, now I'm getting the vibe that offering some of my fish here would offend some club members, since I'm only a forum member, not a club member. That doesn't motivate me to join the club, since who knows when, if ever, I'll get the time to attend a meeting, auction, or whatever. I also give plenty of time and resources to important causes of my own choosing and according to my own priorities, so there's no guilting me into something additional. Not that I wouldn't enjoy your club activities if I had the opportunity. But it does cause me to question why I'd want to post a for sale thread here, just to be considered some sort of deadbeat because I'm not a club member. Is that really the vibe you want here?

Like I said, it wouldn't offend me if you decided to make membership a requirement to use the Marketplace or if at some point this became a club only forum. But from my vantage point, either do that or let people feel welcome to be here and welcome to use forum features according to forum guidelines.

Just an opinion from a nobody that no one here knows much about.

I think most everyone in the CCA realizes that there are folks who are on our forum, like you, who can only participate on the forum.

And I think most everyone appreciates the forum traffic and insight from those outside of the club. Keep on posting, keep on contributing. And invite your friends. Buy from our members and sponsors. And sell something occasionally.

That said, folks - especially those who aren't members - who primarily use the forum/club to sell Craigslist-flipped stuff, fish outside of our auctions, etc. are, in my opinion, taking advantage.

I'm finished explaining why contributing $1.67 per month toward supporting the CCA isn't unreasonable for those who gain value from the club. Lord knows that a lot of people contribute much more than what they have to. Without them there wouldn't be a club or a forum...

Matt

dogofwar said:

That said, folks - especially those who aren't members - who primarily use the forum/club to sell Craigslist-flipped stuff, fish outside of our auctions, etc. are, in my opinion, taking advantage.

Matt

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Since I've yet to post a for sale item in the Marketplace I'm not conversant with the guidelines specific to this forum for doing so. But as a mod or Admin on other forums, that seems to be a common concern-- whether someone is using a marketplace type forum as a community member and hobbyist or basically using it as a commercial venture-- as the forum owner and/or forum staff chooses to define 'commercial'. Fine line sometimes, but our view was crossing the line basically meant competing with forum sponsors and so we'd invite that person to either pay to be a sponsor or stop posting items for sale. Not telling you guys what to do or saying you may not already do that.

I think most everyone in the CCA realizes that there are folks who are on our forum, like you, who can only participate on the forum.

And I think most everyone appreciates the forum traffic and insight from those outside of the club. Keep on posting, keep on contributing. And invite your friends. Buy from our members and sponsors. And sell something occasionally.

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In my humble opinion, that's something that wasn't initially clear in this thread and, after certain comments, needed to be made clear, not necessarily for me personally, but for the potential impression given by the thread itself.

dogofwar said:

That said, folks - especially those who aren't members - who primarily use the forum/club to sell Craigslist-flipped stuff, fish outside of our auctions, etc. are, in my opinion, taking advantage.

I'm finished explaining why contributing $1.67 per month toward supporting the CCA isn't unreasonable for those who gain value from the club. Lord knows that a lot of people contribute much more than what they have to. Without them there wouldn't be a club or a forum...

Matt

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Ive been busy working.
Looks like now we just looking to **** people off. You seem to like to do that. To argue just to argue.
This forum is open and non members are welcome to post within reason. Don't like it, then feel free to have a Board vote and I will close it. The only reason I even checked this thread is I have 4 complaints about it and you so far today. And the Day is young.

The only reason I even heard if this club was the off handed mention of the market place. I posted 1 item for sale and ended up selling it off of Craigslist. I have also set up to buy 1 fish from a member(next week). I have only been on this forum for about a week. Not really interested in meetings or what not I was just looking to hook up with some local cichlid lovers and buy/trade. Not really planning on selling much if anything else. Then this thread popped up on my radar screen. At first I felt a little guilted into possibly paying for a membership and was planning on doing it anyways when I got paid on Wednesday just for the hot discount. Having spent over $1000 on fish stuff this month getting my tanks up and going, I was not going to risk pissing the wife off anymore this week by spending more money. As I followed this thread my opinion on membership has changed. I first thought it would be cool to be part of the organization but to be pretty much told that people like me are taking advantage of a club I have only heard of for a week is really disheartening. I now feel guilty about even using this market place. The sad part about the whole situation is that member benefit from outsiders dropping in and buying and selling. The hardest thing to accomplish in business is to get people in the store. The same applies for clubs. After my one purchase is complete next week the app for this forum will be deleted off of my phone. I work on most weekends so i wouldnt of been able to attend many meetings.... if this thread was not posted you would of had a new member. Pressure sales don't work on some people.

God bless



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Acpape0 said:

I first thought it would be cool to be part of the organization but to be pretty much told that people like me are taking advantage of a club I have only heard of for a week is really disheartening. I now feel guilty about even using this market place.

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It is very cool to be a part of a club and its very rewarding. I don't think YOU are included in the category of people "taking advantage" seeing that you've only been on the forum less than a week. Its the folks that seem to only use this site as an alternative to Craigslist but contribute very little if not all to other threads.

Acpape0 said:

The sad part about the whole situation is that member benefit from outsiders dropping in and buying and selling. The hardest thing to accomplish in business is to get people in the store. The same applies for clubs.

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The fact that you compared this club to a store is exactly the problem. This isn't Capital Cichlid Marketplace its Capital Cichlid Association, a Club. Its about being a part of a club or organization with people that share the same interest you do and being able to share your experiences with.

Acpape0 said:

After my one purchase is complete next week the app for this forum will be deleted off of my phone. I work on most weekends so i wouldnt of been able to attend many meetings.... if this thread was not posted you would of had a new member. Pressure sales don't work on some people.

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That is your right. See you around. No love lost.

ugh... can we please close this thread?

no good can come of this...

It's called an analogy !

That's easy purchase cancelled.
Peace


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Wow I feel like the purpose was to get people to join and help out a little. Maybe bring a baked good or two offer some advice, pay the membership so people can meet somewhere etc...it sucks that you feel like you have to cancel a sale but I bet the seller has nothing to do with pressuring you.

We don't get along with everyone but we respect one another. I will guarantee you, you will return. Don't let one or a few people turn you off. Just like joining anything, you will learn to fit in and learn each individual and know that one voice is not the voice of all.

Also you can always say no...just know people are willing to help those who help out, either with the club or with individual members.



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Not sure why I'm inserting myself into this but here's something for all to consider. The club would not be as strong as it is without the forum and the forum wouldn't be without the club. I began as a member of the forum, without it I wouldn't know about the club. I have said it before quite recently actually, promotion only goes so far. If your promoting something that isn't attractive to the prospects promotion is a waste of time at best. Likewise if something is very attractive people won't know about it without promotion. Its a balancing act and if one side gets to heavy its a failure. I often hear from people that they feel somewhat pressured into joining unfortunately this extra pressure takes away from the overall attractiveness of the club. There is a bright side, NO Member is asked to pay more for a larger share of the club or more "power". Yes some contribute more but this is called generosity. If they are doing it with other motives they should be called on it immediately. This 20$ keeps it fair, I deserve to be hear just as much as the president. I have just as much say as the next guy and I **** sure won't be scared away by one or two people who have conflicting personalities. I don't contribute as much as others, if I could I would. This doesn't mean they deserve to be here more than me. I would invite anyone with a bitter taste to hang around, get to know some people, share some advice. You will find there is a lot of good people here, club and forum members. After all this is a hobby the people who use this site for financial gain with greed as their motivation know who they are and I myself don't associate with them. This is the only way we can eliminate them and still remain attractive as a club and forum. This is all just my opinion after all my 20$ didn't pay for me to make your opinion.

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I think people are getting the wrong idea. We are certainly not forcing anyone to join. Think of it this way. The CCA sets up monthly meetings including a marketplace and great speakers which brings many fish keepers around the area together to buy, sell, and trade their items. This costs money, plain and simple. So if you are a non-paying member of this forum, and plan to attend these events, you are basically attending them for free. Its like going to some random persons birthday party and eating all the food. The idea is that these events are set up by people with the financial support of all the paying members. So I can see why people are frustrated when there are non paying members using these events with the paying members. It doesn't make sense that some people use these great events for free, which are set up financially by the paying members. Its easy to see why some people feel they are being taken advantage of.

Pretty sure you need to be a member to go to club events. The events that are open to the public have paid admission

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The point is that some people are paying to keep this awesome club running while others are just using the benefits for free. I can see why some people are upset.

I agree but this is where there is a fine line. When is a forum member taking advantage of a club privilege? There are very defined boundaries between club and forum members, If the club as whole feels those boundaries need to be changed I'm all for it. As of now the main problem seems to be just the market place being open to forum members. More specifically being open to forum members who are greedy and motivated by financial gain rather than enjoying the hobby. I don't agree with that, no one does but do we close it down despite the few bad apples? All the events that require income such as rent, speaker fees, travel, food.......require full membership (except forum access). Do these guidelines need to be changed to include reaping benifits from the marketplace without either membership or a percentage going to the club? I think thisbis what this thread started out to address and got twisted from there. I'm all for rethinking the marketplace guidelines especially if it gets funds for the club. You can't judge a guy for using the forum and abiding by all the current rules, well atleast to an extent.

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Folks:

Sorry for not commenting in this thread earlier, but I was out of town on business and just now finally had the time to sit down and read the thread.

I think the thread has run its course. I'm disappointed that some folks are disappointed, as I don't think that the intent of the thread was to do so. The facts are that the CCA is a real community of people and the forum is a method of communication for these folks. We have guests and forum only members, and in my opinion, that is a good thing. I too was once someone who was just keeping fish, had no idea that fish clubs even existed, and stumbled upon this forum by accident. I lurked for a bit, used the marketplace (by actually giving away fish) and eventually decided to come check out a meeting. Once I attended, I was hooked. This club is a group of great people that are excited about the hobby. Now, some five years later, some of my closest personal friends are people that I met through this club. The CCA is something that I truly enjoy being a part of. Looking back, I can say that the main reason that I became a board member of the club was that I wanted to have other people have the same experience that I have had. I hope that I am doing the club justice as its president and that there are people who are like me and have found a community that they want to be a part of. I know that there are dozens of really good people that I have met over the years that share my same love for the hobby that I connected with through the club.

I also understand that a fish club isn't for everyone. Different people like different things. That's okay. That's good. Contribute to the club as you see fit. But also understand that this club is run by folks who volunteer their time to help provide a service and a community for others. It isn't a full time job, but something that is done out of their desire to give back to others. Because of this, folks become passionate about the club.

I hope this makes sense. I'm going to close the thread now. If you have a comment or question, please feel free so shoot me a PM.

Jon