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All male tropheus?

olzkool

Members
After reading the "tropheus keepers" thread I was wondering if an all male troph tank is even remotely possible. I have an all male mbuna and 2 all male peacock/hap tanks. I am combining the 2 hap/peacock tanks and was initially thinking a tang tank, now I'm pondering the possibility of an all male troph tank. Will it work? Has anybody tried this? Or am I just asking for a total failure?
 

Cichlid Lips

Members
That's really going to depend on what you trying to do. One strain, two, three, five?

May be the #1 question asked about Trophs but there are so many variables, and we all know certain fish in a group will be cool, and others not so cool so at best I would say it is a lucky roll of the dice. I found the same to be true of saltwater fish, and they say you can have this, and can't have that and I wish I had a nickel every time I was given bad info.

I'm not going to say you can't, but I certainly won't say you can either. I know for me the best way to go about it is starting with fry all around the same age and raise them all together and pull the females once they can be vented. It can get expensive for sure.

I have seen where one male controls everything that happens, no one ever gets good color. I have also seen tanks where all males expressed awesome color.

I don't think you'll have much luck with anything other than fry, but maybe someone has done it that could share.

I really need to go back and read some of the rules here, but rather than link you to another page here is a copy and paste written by

"John N. Davidson"

What Tropheus can I put together is a question we all have asked. The most common issue relates to mixing different types of Tropheus in one tank to make sure they don’t interbreed, to make sure one group does not overpower the other and to make sure there are not too many fish in a tank.

We all want our tanks to feature the most beautiful fish. There are a number of beautiful Tropheus. So what can I do to make sure I have a beautiful tank and don’t create problems?

First of all, please let me say that the enclosed is not a scientific article. I am relating my personal experience along with the experiences I have gathered from other Tropheus keepers.

One of the first things to realize is that by mixing Tropheus, you possibly will get mixed results out of all of the fish. A single group will have a dominant fish, or two, and the colors of most, if not all of the fish in the group will come through well. When you mix groups of fish you can run into the problem that none of them exhibit great colors or only one of the groups exhibits excellent color. In a perfect world we all have enough tanks to place one group in each tank and get the maximum effect from each group. I would have to move out of my house to achieve that effect or at least add on another house to get there.

Tropheus break down into the following types:

Annectens: The most common is the Polli or Lyretail.


Duboisi: There are basically three different duboisi. The most popular is the Maswa, or yellow band. There is also the Karilani, which is a narrow white band duboisi and the Kigoma which is a wide white band duboisi.


Brichardi: Examples of brichardi are; Mpimbwe, Kipili, Ulwile and Ujiji. The fry tend to have stripes and the adults do not. Fry tend to look very different from the adults.


Sp. “Blackâ€: Examples are: Bemba, Kiriza, Bulu Point, Ikola and Karamba. The adults tend to be black with a vertical stripe or bar, such as Ikola, Kiriza, Bemba or black with spots, such as Bulu Point or Karamba. These fish mostly come from the northern part of the lake.


Moorii: Examples of moorii are: Chaitika; Red Rainbows (Kambwimba and others), Ilangi, Mpulungu, Murago, Linangu, Kala and Lufubu. As small fry these fish are virtually indistinguishable. Adults tend to either have stripes or are of the Rainbow variety with many colors, usually a yellow, orange or red included. These fish mostly come from the southern part of the lake.


Sp. “Redâ€: Examples of sp. “Red†are; Chimba, Kachese, Chisanse and Moliro. Adults generally do not have stripes, but a red or dark red background with varying redness in the fins. These fish tend to come from the southwestern part of the lake.
Generally, you can combine any two or more of the above different types without running a great risk of interbreeding. (Please remember that virtually any fish will interbreed under the right circumstances.) By mixing fish of different types you reduce the risk of interbreeding, but you can never eliminate it. Should you mix fish in the same group, you do run a greater risk of interbreeding. Therefore, mixing moorii and duboisi is okay. As is, mixing sp. “Black“ with brichardi, or mixing duboisi with moorii. Mixing Mpulungu and Ilangi (both moorii) is not a real good idea. You can refer to the literature on Tropheus to get a better idea of which fish fall into what type. This way you can better determine what fish you can put together.

The sp. “Red†is a fairly new designation, and I am sure there will be more designations in the future as well. It has not been my practice to mix sp. “Red†with moorii, as I have feared interbreeding. It would appear to me, from what research I have done, that mixing the groups will probably not cause the same interbreeding as mixing two groups of moorii.

Tropheus tend to develop social hierarchies. There will almost always be a male in a tank that becomes the dominant male, usually staking out his territory at one end. (In rare cases a female will do this.) In a large enough tank, you will end up with two or males becoming dominant and the remainder of the fish usually stay in the middle of the tank.

When you mix two or more types of Tropheus, you end up having a dominant male from one of the groups. What that means is that one of the groups will likely breed more frequently than the others. You really can’t put two groups together and expect them both to breed with the same frequency. One group will end up on top of the breeding.

The sp. “Black†and brichardi seem to come out on top in the breeding area when mixed with moorii. Part of this may be due to the moorii type possibly being a little more difficult to breed. moorii will still breed when mixed with another type, it just seems they are slightly overshadowed b the other types. Duboisi don’t seem to pay attention to anyone else in the tank, so they make a real good choice to mix with other Tropheus. Mixing sp. “Black†and brichardi does not seem to have as much impact on breeding as other combinations.

I have mixed different types of Tropheus with success. There is nothing wrong at all with it. The feeding habits of each type are basically the same. Aggression between the different types is uncommon. Most Tropheus aggression is between their own type.

Finally, please remember that this is not scientific; I am only passing along what has worked for me and for others I have spoken with. I don’t guarantee any of the ideas in this article will work, but they have for others and me. We are not scientists and this is not a perfect world, so we can’t always get it right. These fish are living beings so they will do funny things occasionally.

I hope you have enjoyed reading my ideas. Happy Tropheus keeping!
 

Cichlid Lips

Members
I also wanted to add that I "think" most Troph keepers would agree, more fish is better to not have any one fish get singled out, which pretty much is in disagreement with the author.

And BTW if you haven't ever seen a one strain male and female tank, here is a comrades Red Rainbow community. Pretty outstanding, and you could easily add one other strain and have even more contrast.
:D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StHRa1d9HJA
 

olzkool

Members
Awesome,awesome, info. Thanks a lot mark.

My hope was to do the same thing I've do e with my other all male tanks. As many individual males of different species and colors I can find and over crowd the heck out of em. Just don't know if it will be a blood bath. I have a mbuna tank with around 50 different males and have never had a problem. I almost always introduce fish in groups, in the dark, and they are generally smaller than the existing stock. I've been pretty lucky. I've had that tank for a very long time. I was hoping someone tried this with trophs already so I know if it was a success or an epic fail
 

Cichlid Lips

Members
Awesome,awesome, info. Thanks a lot mark.

My hope was to do the same thing I've do e with my other all male tanks. As many individual males of different species and colors I can find and over crowd the heck out of em. Just don't know if it will be a blood bath. I have a mbuna tank with around 50 different males and have never had a problem. I almost always introduce fish in groups, in the dark, and they are generally smaller than the existing stock. I've been pretty lucky. I've had that tank for a very long time. I was hoping someone tried this with trophs already so I know if it was a success or an epic fail

I did a search on Youtube last night after I posted, and found 9 people currently doing mixed Troph tanks.

They are happening.
:D
 

YSS

Members
After reading the "tropheus keepers" thread I was wondering if an all male troph tank is even remotely possible. I have an all male mbuna and 2 all male peacock/hap tanks. I am combining the 2 hap/peacock tanks and was initially thinking a tang tank, now I'm pondering the possibility of an all male troph tank. Will it work? Has anybody tried this? Or am I just asking for a total failure?

Why would you want an all male tropheus tank?
 

jonclark96

Past CCA President
When I first read the thread, I thought of an all male tropheus tank with multiple variants/types similar to an all male hap or peacock tank. You'd have a group of nice, colorful fish without the fear of hybridization. Same rationale why folks have all male hap/peacock tanks.
 

olzkool

Members
Ok so I'll give you the long answer then. He pretty much just nailed it. I have show tanks upstairs that are currently all male mbuna and all male hap/peacock. They are for just that, show. People love looking at them and it gives me the opportunity to collect as many species and variants as possible. I am more of a collector than anything. I collect a lot of different things. That's what got me started with all this and like most hobbies evolved into a full out breeding facility in the basement. Needless to say I'm getting kind of bored with my show tanks and want to add another to start the process over again. Honestly I get most of my enjoyment out of finding all these different fish, buying them, and setting up a nice tank. It took me years to do my mbuna tank and at 50+ different individuals I am kinda maxed out. So..... I thought this would be a cool new project to try. Like any project I take on, I figured I would ask people that know more than me to see if it's possible. I have no experience with trophs and did not want to go into this blindly. If troph keepers here say it's not feasible, than I will just do a mixed male tang tank.
Thanks for all the info
 

olzkool

Members
And no fighting and killing over females, or stripping, or hybrids, or dull colored fish, or all of the same looking fish, etc, etc
 

YSS

Members
Tropheus are monomorphic. I see why one would want all male hap or peacock tank, but not for monomorphic species. Tropheus' are fun fish. I don't see a need to have an all male tropheus tank nor have I seen anyone do an all male tropheus tank. That's why I asked if there was a reason for wanting an all male tank. I've had mixed trophies tank and it worked out great for me. There will be fighting in the tank whether all male or not.
 

olzkool

Members
I understand they are monomorphic but I made the assumption that the males were temporarily dimorphic or dichromic when showing aggression or breeding behavior. Or at least "Colored up". In my mbuna tank the fish change almost before your eyes. One fish will be drab and seconds later fire up to be extraordinary. They do this constantly and take turns. In a lot of the Tropheus videos I've watched there seems to be fish that are much brighter than the rest. Again I made the assumption these were the males. Hence the reason for this thread to get a little education from experienced keepers. Either way I don't want any breeding going on, especially cross breeding. I have 20 tanks downstairs to watch for that if I want to see breeding behavior. I keep comparing to my mbuna tank because that is what I have the most experience with. In that tank aggression went to a minimum when I removed all the females. Before that they were vicious. Furthermore it allows me to get as many different types as possible. So my question really is not is it worth it or is there a logical reason other than what I have already mentioned, but instead will it work? Or does it just not work with male tropheus? You seem to have a lot of experience with them so hopefully you can answer it. I would rather not be the experiment.
 
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Raven20

Members
I understand they are monomorphic but I made the assumption that the males were temporarily dimorphic or dichromic when showing aggression or breeding behavior. Or at least "Colored up". In my mbuna tank the fish change almost before your eyes. One fish will be drab and seconds later fire up to be extraordinary. They do this constantly and take turns. In a lot of the Tropheus videos I've watched there seems to be fish that are much brighter than the rest. Again I made the assumption these were the males. Hence the reason for this thread to get a little education from experienced keepers. Either way I don't want any breeding going on, especially cross breeding. I have 20 tanks downstairs to watch for that if I want to see breeding behavior. I keep comparing to my mbuna tank because that is what I have the most experience with. In that tank aggression went to a minimum when I removed all the females. Before that they were vicious. Furthermore it allows me to get as many different types as possible. So my question really is not is it worth it or is there a logical reason other than what I have already mentioned, but instead will it work? Or does it just not work with male tropheus? You seem to have a lot of experience with them so hopefully you can answer it. I would rather not be the experiment.

Chris,

Try Trophs.com for a helluva lot more info...
 
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